You may have heard about the “Amerikate” comic by Kate Leth or at least seen the pages being circulated. WWAC has brought together five women who love the Amerikate ship to read it and discuss our feelings—positive, negative, and in-between.
But before we get to the comic—a little background on Amerikate and the buzz about it. What is Amerikate? America Chavez and Kate Bishop first met during Gillen and McKelvie’s run on Young Avengers and are probably best remembered for this exchange, which is credited as being the foundation of their ship:
In fandom, their ship name is Amerikate, and this Femslash Friday article on the Toast is as good a ship manifesto/rationale as any.
Amerikate and (in) Secret Wars
When Secret Wars, Secret Love was announced, the original version of the press release on Marvel.Com had an Amerikate story listed, which was then, quickly pulled and corrected as having been a mistake, and indeed, there was no Amerikate story in Secret Wars, Secret Love—but Kate Leth’s coy tweets had the Amerikate shippers shippy sense tinging.
The story in question came out last week in Secret Wars Too, a self-declared parody comic with a strange meta-framing device. What ties these stories together, in theory, is that they are all one-shots from different universes, some of which we’ve seen glimpses of in other Secret Wars comics. All of the other stories are written by men, and the other stories seem to be competing for the title of craziest scenario, ranging from a story where Thor saves Spider-Man’s Uncle Ben from being killed, a story featuring Dennis Dunphy a.k.a. D-Man, a universe where Galactus rules Hell’s Kitchen, and a story where Daredevil is an anthropomorphized bear called Beardevil.
No, really.
The placement of the Amerikate story within this comic sparked some interesting discussion among the WWAC staff and contributors, and evoked a range of reactions, with some people loving the Amerikate story and hating the rest of the comics, and some people loving the rest of the comics and disliking the Amerikate story as not being romantic enough. Five women were brought together to discuss five pages that raise a lot of questions about Marvel, queer representation, and what can be defined as queer representation.
“Pizza Quest”
Script: Kate Leth
Art: Brittany L. Williams
Colors: Megan M. Wilson
Lettering and Production: Travis Lanham
Gut reactions! Did you like this comic? What was your favorite part? How do you feel about the writing, and/or the artwork? What does it mean for you that this Amerikate comic exists?
Anna: I thought it was cute! I liked the sight gags of all the different realms and the naked Wolverine comment made me chuckle out loud. I was more happy than I most likely needed to be about Pizza Dog’s appearance, but overall, I just wished there was more of everything. More America and Kate adventures, please!
Kate: I would totally buy an ongoing The Adventures of Amerikate comic—I would double buy it, with a digital and print copy! Especially if it was this creative team. Kate Leth is amazing, but I also loved the art by Brittany L. Williams. I also loved the Pizza Dog plot twist, Wolverine being naked with strategically placed butterflies, and this line:
In short: this comic was brilliant and deserved so much better than to be in Secret Wars Too.
Desiree: What an utter disappointment that this comic is only a couple pages long, we deserve more. Kate Leth has a real talent for writing snappy, but fun dialogue. I really enjoyed how America and Kate were both able to openly ogle hot’Vengers during their travels. I liked their overall dynamic, which was still classic Amerikate even with Kate being from a different dimension. The artwork was very cute and reminded me a bit of Secret Love’s Danny and Misty’s story. I’m with Kate; I want a Kate Leth to write a book about the adventures of Kate and America. Where’s the Kickstarter?
Kat: This was a really cute one-shot! But I’m not actually sure an on-going like this is what I’d want out of a comic starring these two, especially with how little romantic tension there seems to be between them. It’s more of a story that you could wear shipper goggles to read, but nothing explicit is given to you as a reader, and I’d rather read something like a will-they-or-won’t-they kind of comedy where it’s clear that both are queer and attracted to each other? Plus I think I’d want more action.
Melissa: This comic was adorable and left me with a hunger for more! I agree with Desiree that we all deserve more of this. I have questions. Is America flirting with Kates from every domain? Is everyone Asgardian in Doomgard? How cute is the Hulk in Rule 63 with her little ponytail? I think my favorite part is Kate’s reason for needing to find Barton. This was a cute adventure that can really stand as its own universe. Kate Leth’s art is perfect for it.
Kate Leth called this her Amerikate comic and is an open fan of the ship, but the comic itself doesn’t show any romantic interaction between America and Kate. Is this an Amerikate comic? Is romantic interaction necessary to earn that label?
Anna: I don’t think it’s necessary, but it would have been nice. If this is all that we ever get it would be disappointing, but I guess it’s a nice bonus? Okay, I’ve convinced myself in the span of that sentence to demand more and more saucy Amerikate.
Kate: I am here for all kinds of Amerikate interaction. It doesn’t have to be romantic or sexual on the page in order for me to support it or label it as Amerikate. I can take care of that on my own, thanks. And I think that to demand romantic or sexual interaction for something to be part of a ship, especially a queer ship, is really problematic and part of the problem with heteronormativity. That is to say—if the only thing that makes a relationship queer is romantic and sexual interaction, that continues the problematic representation in media of queer people always being sexualized—which is bad for queer people, but also erases asexuality and demi orientations.
Desiree: It’s Amerikate if you only go by a strict friendship definition, but it’s not Amerikate given that there’s no real romantic context between them. Unless you count America blushing when Lady Kate implores her to go find Clint Barton.
I’d say romance doesn’t have to be inherently sexual, however, and they could imply romance without implying anything sexual occurring. That being said, it was clear that both girls in the comic were sexual beings in their open, sexual, appreciation of various hot’vengers.
I wasn’t expecting Amerikate to be explicit however, because Marvel editorial is still really ginger—if not outright exclusionary—when it comes to queer representation. Yes, there’s Angela, but she’s “Angela without a label,” which is obviously bothersome. I was happy, however, that America was able to openly showcase her interest in women. I’d be fine with them just being friends, but I’d love to see something actually come from their interactions in a romantic sense, which, again, I don’t believe means there would have to be sexual implications. Romance doesn’t equate sex. And demi and ace individuals can still experience romantic attraction, but such things have to be explicitly stated within a narrative. Marvel can’t even state that Hercules is bisexual, so I was never hoping for much in regards to legitimate queer Amerikate.
Kat: This is definitely not something I would call “Amerikate” because there’s no romance, implied or not, between them. America is there and checkin’ out ladies, which is nice I guess, but there’s no indication that Kate is queer or interested in America. I could see it being better described as a good story for fans of Amerikate or fans of America and Kate’s friendship, but because I am an Old; I expect ship smush names to imply romance and romantic interaction, and this didn’t give me anything textual. The representation here for me is a queer character (America), and not any kind of queer relationship (labeless Angela at least gets a girlfriend, you know?). I’d seen that Kate Leth was super excited about writing an “Amerikate” story, and since she’s bisexual herself I guess I was hoping the story would be explicitly about queer romance or at least flirtation. I went in expecting girlfriends and got gal pals instead.
Melissa: Yes, this can be read as friendship, but when you consider that America punched her way through multiple dimensions just so Kate could have pizza, it gives their relationship an added depth. I think the whole issue is romantic. It seems like a date to me—a strange, dimension hopping one.
Did any of you read Secret Wars, Secret Love? Would this Amerikate story have fit in with the other stories in that collection?
Anna: I didn’t read any of the Secret Wars, Secret Love except to browse the Squirrel Girl wins a date with Thor story and the Misty Knight and Danny Rand story. I wanted to! I just ran out of time and dollars.
Kate: I organized the review of Secret Wars, Secret Love, and I think the fact that at least half of the stories didn’t have couple-based romantic interaction allows for a story like this one. The Ms. Marvel story is about unrequited love, and the Squirrel Girl story is about Winning a Date with Thor. And I think this one would have been a better choice than the Daredevil story that led off the issue, which, as Kat pointed out in the review, had a weird tone compared to the rest of the stories. And as I pointed out, there were no queer romances in Secret Wars, Secret Love. This would have been more tonally appropriate and given queer lady representation!
Desiree: I didn’t read Secret Wars, Secret Love so I’m not sure if I can give a proper opinion on this. This story was more about friendship than love, so it could be argued the love of friendship. But nothing is made explicit in the story that Kate and America are interested in each other romantically, sexually, or otherwise, so no, I wouldn’t think it’s a good fit if Secret Wars, Secret Love was specifically about romantic love of various kinds and not friendship love. If there was romantic inklings in the story I’d say hell yes, but alas, there wasn’t.
Kat: I think it’s the only story in Secret Wars Too that would have made sense in Secret Love, but I’d be annoyed if the only queer main characters in Secret Love were not actively, you know, being in love, so I’m glad it wasn’t. It had a similar tone as some of the Secret Love stories, but that was a much less tonally consistent compilation than this one so it doesn’t feel like it was meant to go there and somehow ended up in this one.
Melissa: I’ve seen pages of the Misty/Danny story, but I haven’t read the entire issue. From what I know about the other stories, I think Amerikate would have fit in fine. Secret Wars, Secret Love was about relationships. Whether you think this Amerikate story is romantic or platonic, you have to admit that it fits in more with the theme of Secret Wars, Secret Love than the everything and the kitchen sink theme of Secret Wars Too.
What would the implications have been if this story had been included in Secret Wars, Secret Love rather than in Secret Wars Too? In other words, what are the implications of this story being included in the throwaway parody comic rather than the romance comic?
Anna: I admit that it did annoy me a bit. While not every ship or comic for that matter, has to be treated with utmost seriousness, it would have been nice for it not to be Beardevil-adjacent.
Kate: I think this was an editorial fail. You can’t say you’re a queer friendly publisher when you pull shit like this. Having this amazingly awesome story in a bullshit throwaway parody comic is a slap in the face to the talent of Kate Leth and Brittany L. Williams, and a slap in the face of queer fans and queer shippers. It’s worse than crumbs. It’s an insult.
Desiree: While not directly romantic, like I said before, it could have been about the love between friends. That matters as well. Plus it would have given the story more of a queer overtone if it had been included in Secret Wars, Secret Love. I could have interpreted as a potential love story road trip between these two characters, which is probably why Marvel included it in the parody comic instead. Both America and Kate are very popular, and we can’t have popular female characters with legit queer labels right? Wait, give it a couple months and Marvel Editorial will come out with, “America isn’t technically a lesbian.”
Kat: I feel pretty ambivalent about it either way—I don’t think putting this story in Secret Love would have made Marvel editorial seem more serious about queer romances, because it’s not a queer romance. Representationally, it didn’t queer any previously straight character or relationship. So I’m fine with the fact that a friendship joke story about two characters I like are in a joke story comic rather than one explicitly labeled romance. I liked the other parody stories and felt this one fit the tone and humor of the others while not being quite as in-jokey about Marvel editorial decisions; they were all centered around quirks that came from Battleworld being comprised of many different universes’ characters.
Melissa: I think it would mean they’re at least willing to entertain the idea of this relationship becoming canon. More importantly, it would be a nice step towards reaching out to new audiences. Marvel is doing better in terms of diversity than some other unnamed companies, but it still has a lot of work to do. Secret Wars, Secret Love got a lot of buzz for being Marvel’s “romantic” book. It would have been nice to see a story about an interracial lesbian relationship in that book.
Final Thoughts: Should people buy this comic? How can you show support in order to encourage Marvel to do more comics like this one without buying it?
Anna: I didn’t know that this was a parody comic, so when I saw that Kate Leth has mentioned it, I was really excited. I’m less so now because it’s easier for readers to say, “Look at all these ridiculous things that I can ignore like Beardevil and Amerikate. Pfft!”
Kate: That’s my dilemma and has been for the past few months. I love Marvel. I love Marvel characters. I love a lot of the writers and artists working for Marvel and some of the stories they produce. But how can I say with my dollars, since that’s the only thing that matters, that stories like this one deserve respect? How do I support this without supporting the other garbage, the bad editorial calls, and the way this comic was treated?
Desiree: This is one of those moments where I want to say, yes to support female characters written and drawn by female creators. But the parody bit really gets me. Why is Amerikate included in a parody comic alongside Darebear? That’s ridiculous. The comic was certainly humorous; it was glip, and adorable, but it would have fit right alongside the Danny and Misty short in Secret Love or the Ms. Marvel/Ghost Rider short. This was a great story, completely out of place with a bunch of silly ones. It feels like Marvel didn’t want to include the Amerikate story in Secret Love so people wouldn’t think they may actually go anywhere with them as a legitimate couple, which is insulting to say the least.
Kat: I, unlike the editorial framing of this piece, had a pretty great time reading this comic—it’s essentially a bunch of Secret Wars omake comics, making fun of Secret Wars. If you’re one of those people who don’t give a whit about crossovers or events, or hasn’t been paying attention the Secret Wars and the Hickvenger books, I’d give this one a pass because the stories in it are pretty meta.
You can definitely enjoy some of the stories without that Secret Wars background, but the navel-gazing in Jonathan Hickman’s first story, for example, is probably not going to be funny (if you’re a fan of Ramon Villalobos, making fun of Scott Summers, AND the friendship between America and Kate Bishop, though, you are the target audience here).
I guess I don’t have a problem with Kath Leth’s story being in this book along with the other parodies—the theme of everything except the first story was to be as over-the-top as possible with the alternate realities premise of Secret Wars, and a Kate Bishop from a universe without modern New York and her interdimensional friend fit right into that from me. If it was actually a queer-romance-themed comic nestled in the pages with Beardevil, then I would be a little salty. Instead, I’m saltier about being hyped for an Amerikate story and getting instead some gals being pals.
Melissa: This is a ridiculous comic. If that’s your thing, pick it up. Personally, I’m very curious about what’s going on with Darebear. Cynic me wants to say that I wouldn’t buy this just to support the Amerikate comic because I’m pretty sure Marvel doesn’t care. On the other hand, Marvel might be floating this story out to see if there is a hunger for it and chose Secret Wars Too because it’s a low risk title. As for showing support without buying it, I would suggest getting on social media and talking about how much you love it. Ask Marvel for more. If you have a hotline to Sana Amanat, time to use it.
